Digital Advertising and Marketing

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Digital Advertising and Marketing with Kyle Porter

Here’s how Kyle can help you.

You want to be able to focus on what you do best, so that you can grow your business and actually enjoy the process.

And to do that, you need a simple, clear, and effective marketing plan that just works. The problem is that there are so many voices telling you all kinds of different things that it’s hard to know what to do next to bring in new customers. You’re left feeling trapped doing stuff you hate and overwhelmed by everything on your to-do list.

I believe everyone deserves to make a great living doing what they love to do, and that it should be fun to build your business. You should have support and a clear path to the business you’ve dreamed of.

I get it. I’m a local business owner myself and I know what it feels like to look down an empty pipeline and wonder where the next customer is coming from. I had to learn, from a lot of trial and error, exactly what it takes to get customers and keep them coming back again and again, and I can help you do the same thing.

Here’s how we’ll do it:

First, we’ll figure out exactly who your customers are and what they need from you to make their lives better.

Second, we’ll build the marketing materials that drive traffic and generate sales.

Finally, we’ll create a plan to deliver more than your customers would ever expect – creating awesome, memorable experiences that get them spreading the word about your business for you and creating a loyal community of fans.

Before you send another email, post another ad, or write another page on your website, let’s make sure your message is clear and your customers are listening.

So schedule a call with me today, and stop logging countless hours getting nowhere, stuck in a business that owns you instead of the other way around. Instead, let’s build a marketing plan that makes your dream business a reality and brings you the success you deserve.

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Roy (00:06):

Hello and welcome to the business of business podcast. I’m Roy. Uh, you can find us of course, at www dot the business of business podcast. We’re also on iTunes, Stitcher, Google, and Spotify. So today, um, no last week, uh, guests brought up some interesting points about digital marketing. We basically YouTube and that’s a forgotten channel that. Um, you know, uh, I don’t take advantage of. Like I should so reached out and, uh, was talking to Kyle Porter. Who’s with, uh, guide post marketing and, uh. Asked him if he’d come on the show today and then talk to us a little bit about digital marketing.

Uh, so Kyle, welcome to the show first off. Thanks for having me. Hey, you bet. You bet. Yeah, I’ve got so many questions here. You’ll have to watch the time for us today. Make sure because I could talk for a, I could talk for hours to you about this. So, uh, you know, I know. I know a little bit of your history is that you own a martial arts studio for children. You were, uh, doing some digital marketing, digital advertising for yourself and it kind of expanded to helping others. And, uh, yeah. Why don’t you, uh. Why don’t you just tell us a little bit about. You know, kind of how you got here and, um, then we’ll get into it.

Kyle (01:28):

Yeah, so I, um, I opened my business, my, my martial arts gym back in 2015. I opened it because I had worked at martial arts gyms really since I was 14 or 15 years old. And, and had sort of, I felt like, sort of earned my stripe. Gotten to a place where, where I was. I was capable, of launching it on my own.

So, so I did that and I learned really quickly. That I was great at doing the business that I was in. I was great at teaching the classes great at, you know, delivering these awesome experiences for my, for my students. But when it came to actually filling the doors and getting people in the doors, when it was a brand new location, it was a real challenge for me. So it, it was kind of this learning process where I learned through kind of a combination of online and offline efforts, um, you know, community involvement and in tandem with, you know, a really solid social media strategy and, you know.

Frankly just consuming hours and hours of YouTube content on how to build marketing campaigns and, you know, learning a lot from the people who put out a lot of good information and just kind of synthesizing it to figure out what worked best for me, a lot of trial and error and, you know, and we ended up growing really, really fast.

Kyle (02:46):

We did, um, you know, in our, in our first two years, we got to where we were at kind of a run rate of about half a million a year, which for a karate school is pretty substantial. We had, um, you know, we had, we’ve got a couple of hundred students and we’ve got an afterschool program where we pick kids up from schools and, you know, take them back to our facility on a bus, kind of like a daycare program.

And, you know, a lot of that is built on, on two things. Really one is the back of the relationships we have in our community with our, um, you know, with our schools, our elementary schools. And then the other thing is just on the back of a really solid, um, digital and social strategy. So that, um, that definitely is the kind of the crux of, of what’s allowed us to get to this point.

Kyle (03:30):

Then for me, it was, you know, other people, people in my network that. You know, that I was connecting with kind of in my role. As, as the studio owner and, you know, parents of kids that I would teach. And they were saying, you know, what are you doing to grow this business like this? And it just kind of evolved from there. I, um, you know, I’ve always been fascinated with. With words and with copywriting and with, you know, persuasion and just, you know, helping people understand how you can solve their problems.

So I started working with some. You know, some local businesses on that and have kind of expanded that and, you know, now have, have gotten to a place where I’ve worked with a couple of, uh, couple of global brands and, you know, really help them clarify their messaging, you know, communicated in a digital platform and, um, you know, ultimately grow their business.

Roy (04:13):

Okay, cool. Yeah. And, uh, you know, we don’t want to discount that the, um, that social network, the, you know, offline part. Because I know, I know a guy that, uh, basically, you know, he came into town fresh. He, and this has been a long time ago, but he opened up a, um, a taco store. And that’s what he did supported youth teams. Really was in the community and built an awesome business.

But, uh, you know, what we want to talk about is that digital. I’ll have to have you back sometime to talk about that in person. Because that’s, uh, you know, it’s very, very important. Especially for the business that you’re in is that. You know, you have to be out and be in the community. So we never want to discount that. Even though we’re talking more on the digital side, um, you know. One thing that when we had had a previous conversation. That you mentioned is that, you know, when you first started this effort that, uh, you know. You were getting a lots of hits and a lot of activity. The bad thing was it was from eight year olds that don’t pay the bills.

Roy (05:12):

So, um, can you tell us a little bit about that? I think the message, you know, is patients that when we do this, we have to have patience

Kyle (05:20):

Definitely. And it’s patience. It’s also understanding.You know, kind of the, the full customer journey. And, you know, understanding sort of how people interact with each other and how they interact with your business. So we put out, um, our first ever ad on YouTube. And what we did is we targeted to kids videos. You know, videos that kids were watching, you know. Whether it was unboxing videos, where kids are unboxing toys.

I mean, that’s just a huge market. In the, you know, in that sort of YouTube space or whether it’s, um. You know, kids watching other kids play Minecraft or Fortnite. Or, you know, whatever the kind of the games are of the day. Um, so we, we were really specific about the videos that we targeted. We were really specific about this geographic area. Because for, for us as a local business, you know, I can get all the views that I want, right.

Kyle (06:08):

But if they’re coming from Albuquerque, New Mexico and my studio’s in Atlanta, Georgia. You know, it doesn’t really help me that much. So we’re, we’re real specific about, about where we targeted. And what we realized is that, you know, these videos, we’re getting these, this massive number of views. We were excited about that, but it didn’t translate to, it didn’t translate to sales. They didn’t translate to people actually coming in the door. And so, you know, initially our thought was, well, you know, that didn’t work.

It got us, you know, it got us a lot of attention. It made a lot of noise. You know. Rock the boat a little bit. But in terms of actually moving the needle for the business, it didn’t do anything. Well, then all of a sudden, you know, over the course of the next two or three months. What ended up happening was we had these parents that started calling in. Parents that started coming in and they said, you know, my kids saw your ad on YouTube. And they won’t stop talking about it.

Kyle (06:57):

You know, they, they keep saying. Hey, mom, bring me to the, you know. Bring me to the karate school, bring me to the place. You know? And, um, and so we completely discounted the fact that there is. You know, there’s another layer that has to happen in that interaction, where the kid sees the video, they see it over and over again. And, you know, they’re showing it to their mom.

Cause you know, we, we put in stuff where kids are breaking boards. And, you know, running across the mat. Jumping high and kick in and flipping and that kind of stuff. And so it’s stuff that they see, you know. Anytime you’re creating any kind of advertising campaign or any kind of marketing campaign you want to present, you know, you want to present no matter who you’re presenting it to the fi you know, kind of the final version.

Kyle (07:36):

What, you know, if marketing is kind of communicating this before and after transformation, right? You want to show kind of what the end of that transformation looks like. So when you’ve got these kids that are sitting there on their iPads. They’re seeing these other kids that are out really living this adventure, you know, there that are having this great time and they’re going, I want that to be me.

So they talked to mom and dad, and initially it’s kinda like, no, you don’t want to do that. But when it’s persistent, then all of a sudden, now it is making a really big difference in our business. And it’s hard to quantify that kind of stuff. You know, it’s, it’s hard to quantify how many kids saw it and. Then showed their friend who’s sitting next to him and that kid, you know what I mean?

Kyle (08:09):

So it’s, it’s really hard to say we spent. You know, X number of dollars on YouTube ads. And we signed up this many kids as a result of it. Cause it wasn’t that straight path. Right. Um, you know, in some of your digital marketing efforts are going to be that some. You know, you throw money at Facebook, ads, people click on them and. They put in their name, phone number and email address and you call them and. You can say, Hey, look, this person came directly from this ad.

But more often than not particularly for local businesses. You need those eight, nine, 10, 12, 15 touch points. Where they see you on Facebook. They see your, you know, your card out at the barbecue restaurant. They see your, you know, your banner hanging on the baseball field and you know. And then they see you involved in the kids’ school and then they see you on YouTube.

Kyle (08:50):

And then all of a sudden you’re kind of this omnipresent entity. Where they go shoot, if I’m going to do this thing. If I’m going to sign my kids up for karate. Or if I’m going to go get my haircut at a barbershop, or. If I’m going to go order a wedding cake for my wedding. Whatever your business does, you know, all of a sudden you become the only option for those people. Because, you know, it’s not just as simple as like, Hey, I make wedding cakes. Do you want one it’s. You know, check out these wedding cake that I made and check out the haircut that I just did. And all of a sudden you build this reputation. Where, where it’s, you’re playing the long game rather than just this transactional back and forth.

Roy (09:25):

Yeah. So like, uh, you know, trying to pick out the, the videos that you wanted to advertise you, I guess you have a lot of, and I’m going to show my ignorance in this space that do you, is that like you sign up and they just plug you in, where do you get to specify, Hey, I like this video or this type, or how does that selection process go?

Kyle (09:46):

So what you can do is you can advertise on certain channels. So if, you know, if there are, if there are creators on YouTube that have a lot of subscribers, a lot of followers you can choose to advertise directly on those creators channels, you can also target by people who are, you know, kind of to zoom out a little bit more than that you can target based on interest.

You know, so if you have, you know, using that wedding cake company, as an example, you know, if you have people that are interested in bridal magazines and, um, you know, honeymoon vacations and all those things, and you can start to target, um, and it’s, you know, it’s easy to do that on cause cause the, the YouTube ad interface is YouTube is owned by Google. So, you know, it’s, it’s connected to that ad interface.

Kyle (10:32):

It’s through Google. Um, you know, so you’re able to target by these keywords and things that people are searching for. Um, as well as you could just say, um, you know, Hey, I’m in this location and I want to serve customers that are in this location. And so anybody who’s here, you know, because you just kind of want to have sort of a, more of a shotgun kind of strategy where you’re, you know, sprinkle it out to everybody.

Um, or some combination, you know, you say, Hey, look, um, you know, if the target audience is big enough, you know, I’m looking for, you know, motorcycle enthusiasts in Daytona beach, Florida, you know, you’re going to have a pretty significant population there. So, um, you know, it’s kind of determining, do you want to target by interest or are you geographically constrained? You know? And then at that point saying, you know, what does that look like?

Kyle (11:20):

And, you know, and that’s why with any client that I work with now, the first step, the very first thing I have them do before I do anything else is I say, who is it that we’re talking to? Let’s get really clear on who our customer is and get really clear on their pain points, get really clear on what they’re looking for, what they need, how do they define success? How do they define failure? You know, what are they afraid of? What are they searching for all of those things play into how I’m going to target them, you know, in a digital event.

Roy (11:46):

Yeah. So how did you do a lot of like AB testing? Did you like, um, you know, you would think, uh, martial arts may be sports oriented type videos or something like that. So did you have to go through some trial and error to kind of narrow down the types of videos that you wanted to advertise on?

Kyle (12:07):

So for us, for our business specifically, and I want to answer that question directly, but then also kind of tie it to the people who are going to be listening to this for our business. Specifically as a martial arts school, we have really two customers that we have to serve. We have to serve the parent who is actually signing the check every month. And then we have to serve the kid who is actually the person on the mat taking the class, right. So a lot of our marketing efforts, and again, it goes, it goes back to what platform are we on? You know, when we’re talking on Facebook, you know, I’m not reaching any eight to 12 year olds. They’re not there.

You know? And so when I’m on Facebook, when I’m on Instagram, then I’m talking to parents. And so I’m talking about things like giving your kid a place to belong, building a stronger future for your child, you know, protecting them from bullies, defending themselves from strangers, improving focus, better grades, all those things that if I had that, that same message targeted to that eight year old, nine, 10 year ten-year-old, who’s watching videos on YouTube, they don’t care.

Kyle (13:04):

Right. You know, they’re, they’re not, you know, they’re not interested if I, you know, if I sat down and I said, Hey, I’d really like to talk to you about focus for the next 30 seconds. They’d say, yeah, I really like you not to, you know, um,

Roy (13:15):

I, my mom and dad had paid not to have that conversation.

Kyle (13:18):

Yeah. And, and, and so we have to be really, really careful about when we’re talking to kids, you know, and, and when we’re, when we’re showing the ads on, you know, on something like YouTube, where, where it’s, you know, a lot of it is going to be kids who are, you know, watching, watching videos, it’s going to be, it’s going to be, what does this feel like to be there?

You know, what does it feel like to be in class and to be punched targets and have your boxing gloves on and, you know, and actually be kind of immersed in it where that message doesn’t really resonate as much with parents, because they are more concerned with, you know, is this gonna make my kid more focused? Is it going to give them a good physical outlet? Is it going to teach them to protect themselves, teach them confidence, you know, all those kinds of things.

Kyle (13:59):

And so, you know, for us, again, going back to, and, and for, for really any business it’s who is it, that’s going to be purchasing and, or using the product or service that you sell, and then what do they want, you know, how did, how, what, what does success look like for them? Um, you know, and then starting to paint that picture and, you know, and on the other side, people, anytime we’re, we’re advertising, anytime we’re marketing, we have to be aware of the fact that people are either moving towards something or they’re moving away from it, right.

They’re either moving towards a future that they desire or an, or away from a future that they don’t want for themselves. And so with, you know, with, with kids and parents, you know, we have to strike that balance. And, you know, to your, to your answer, your question about like something like AB testing, um, you know, when we start saying the negative side of things, you know, is your kids struggling?

Kyle (14:51):

School, is your kid getting bullied as your kid? You know, all those things they resonate. And this is what I found about talking about pain in general, is it resonates really quickly, but it also can turn people off really quickly, you know? Cause they start getting that, like, who do you think you are talking to me about, you know, about all the things that are going wrong in my life. Like you don’t have any, you know, and so you can, you can catch their attention with pain, you know, and you can say, Hey, look at your kid’s struggling in school. And then you start presenting that solution. You start presenting that bandaid now.

Roy (15:20):

So I, I, because y’all are, you know, action packed. And, uh, like you said, because you, you know, uh, when you want to look for the kids that are going to, you know, generate the interest, have you had a better luck reaching out to them through YouTube or reaching out to the parents through Facebook, Instagram are pretty decent. Mix are kind of hard.

Kyle (15:45):

So it’s a combination of the two. Um, I think that they work, I think it’s, uh, uh, one plus one equals three kind of thing. You know, I think that if I were to take either one of those elements out there would still be some success with it. Um, but at the same time, I think that the fact that both of them are happening simultaneously, it makes it bigger than the sum of the parts. Um, and, and what we like to do is, um, you know, we’ll have it where kids are in videos, you know, kids that we teach.

And so the kids who are seeing those videos, they’re actually seeing their friends, they’re seeing their classmates in those videos. And so what we’re doing is, you know, kind of within this tiny little microcosm, we’re creating, creating little micro celebrities, you know, it’s, you know, it’s kind of like when, you know, when I was a kid, I went to the 1995 Atlanta Braves world series game.

Kyle (16:36):

And through some, I don’t know, miracle, my parents were able to pull off. We had seats for game one of the 95 world series right behind the Braves dugout. And, you know, I grew up in Atlanta, so it was the first row behind the Braves dugout. So I was in the newspaper. I was in the Atlanta journal constitution the next day. And you would have thought the next day, when I walked into school, you would’ve thought I built that school.

I mean, it was like, you know, and, and I didn’t do anything, but just the fact that I was featured in something adds, you know, just incredible credibility to those people. And by extension to that, you know, that organization. And so by, by saying, Hey, look, you know, here’s your friends and they’re out here doing this, you know, nobody wants to miss out on red on the fun stuff, you know?

Kyle (17:15):

And, and so I think that, you know, if you’re, if you’re a business owner and you’re running, you know, and you’re running marketing campaigns, any chance that you have to showcase your customers and talk about their successes and position them in a way where they are kind of the hero of the story. Cause that’s the, that’s the biggest problem, you know?

And that’s, that’s what I see so much because a lot of what I do hinges on kind of this framework of storytelling is companies come into these, these marketing campaigns and they want to talk about, well, our product does this and here’s the features and it, you know, it’s, it’s better and it’s faster and it’s cheaper and it does all that stuff and people don’t care, you know? And, and, and especially when you start getting into, well, we were founded in 1978 and my great, you know, my grandfather founded the company and he passed it on to my dad and my dad, like, I don’t care.

Kyle (18:03):

You know, it doesn’t help me solve my problem. But when, when you start saying, Hey, look, this is, you know, this is Jim. Jim was 20 pounds overweight. You know, he came in and he worked with us and we’ve got this system that’s worked over and over for people just like Jim. And just like you, you know, and here’s what Jim’s doing now. You know, his life is better. His wife is happier.

His kid, you know, he’s out playing in the yard with his kids. You know, we can do the same thing for you. If you’re interested. My company is, you know, looks great in that light, but I’m not talking about my credentials as a trainer. I’m not talking about, you know, really anything that I do, I’m showcasing my client and their success. And that’s a far more effective, you know, marketing campaign than just here’s how great I am.

Roy (18:44):

Yeah. And we were working with the, a client, uh, not long ago that, you know, their website was full of stock pictures. And that was one suggestion is like, you know, do make it personal. People want to know who they’re dealing with. They want to feel like there’s that personal connection with, you know, somebody they know, or like you said, somebody they could, uh, aspire to be eventually

Kyle (19:05):

That’s right. And I always tell people, you know, when you’re writing your website or if you have, you know, if, if you hire me to write your website with any client that I work with, you know, it starts with really just a two hour, you know, probably at least two hour, sit down conversation. Just tell me about your business.

Tell me about what you do. Just so that I can hear these people talk and get a sense of how it is that they speak, because you have to have that authentic voice. And, you know, if you’re writing, you have to be able to capture the way that you communicate verbally and translate that to the written word. Otherwise it feels forced. It feels, you know, it feels stilted. It doesn’t, it doesn’t feel like you’re actually talking to somebody who’s really interested in solving your problem. Yeah.

Roy (19:45):

So you mentioned Instagram earlier. Um, you know, we think of YouTube Facebook, but, um, you know, I like Instagram, I go over there. Cause I just like to look at the pictures. It’s not as much, uh, not as much as the other stuff that goes on, like on Facebook, the drama part let’s put it that way nicely, but so I like to go over there, but being a buyer over there, um, you know, and I don’t know if I really look at it like that or not, but, um, you know, have, do you, have you been able to tell that you have Instagram has worked well for you?

Kyle (20:23):

So yes, yes and no. Um, and, uh, again, it kind of goes back to, let’s take it to something that’s going to be usable for. Um, you know, for the people who are listening, which is, I always tell people, you need to live at the intersection of what you are good at and where your people spend their time. And if you are, you know, if you are advertising and your business serves CEOs and executives and C suite individuals, and, you know, in some sort of consulting capacity or some sort of, you know, business business kind of capacity, you can be on Instagram, you can be on Facebook, you can be on YouTube, but you need to spend a lot of time on LinkedIn. Right, right. Like, you need to understand what these platforms are for and what people’s mindsets are when they’re on these platforms.

Kyle (21:12):

And if, you know, if you’re serving, you know, parents in their thirties, forties, and fifties, who are, you know, who are taking lots of pictures of their kids and, you know, they’re kind of involved in that, like my kids doing stuff like they’re on Instagram and, you know, maybe, uh, you know, a few years older than that, they’re spending time on Facebook.

And so, and then, you know, Instagram is a place where, you know, if you’re, if you’re comfortable on camera, if you’re comfortable taking pictures of yourself and recording yourself on video and you know, and that kind of thing, and that’s who your client is, then that’s a perfect intersection for Instagram. You know? And so for, for my business where the kids that we serve are largely between the ages of five and 12, which means their parents are probably between the ages of 28 and 45. You know what I mean?

Like, that’s, that’s a pretty Instagram, you know, heavy crowd. And so for us, it makes a lot of sense to be on Instagram, in tandem with, you know, parents sees us in Instagram stories, there’s a Facebook ad, running kid goes to YouTube. They see, you know, that kind of stuff. And all of a sudden they’re going like, God, I can’t get away from wrestling.

Roy (22:22):

Exactly. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Yeah. And you know, the nice thing, like I said, um, somebody else had brought up YouTube and it was kind of the forgotten platform for me. So this last week or so I’ve been really pushing to get stuff out there. And, uh, but what is translated from that is that, uh, video clips that I’ve been using fit very nicely into Instagram as well. And so that is, uh, I guess that’s another, the next question is, uh, because it, uh, well, let me ask the question and then I’ll tell you what what’s happened with me, but how do you see a difference between videos and stills? Or do you even do stills, I guess since y’all are kind of

Kyle (23:05):

Yes. Yes. So I don’t necessarily see, I don’t see a difference to the point that I could say like, videos are better than stills or stills better than videos. Um, I think it, I think it has to do with your skill at both or at each, you know, and how, how effective are you, you know, with, with stills, you’re placing a lot of weight and a lot of responsibility on the caption of the post.

You know, if I see a still the next thing I’m gonna do is I’m gonna, I’m gonna scroll down and I’m gonna, I’m gonna see, okay, what did they write about this? What did they want to tell me about this? So to some degree with a still I’m more in charge of the narrative, you know, because I can sit down and if I’m an effective writer, then that’s, that’s a great way for me to leverage Instagram as a platform.

Kyle (23:51):

If maybe I’m not comfortable on video, but that’s where my clients are. And I want to write, you know, maybe I’m taking compelling pictures or using compelling pictures or, you know, whatever it is, but then I’m writing long captions for each post, you know, and then I’m going into the comments and I’m engaging with all the people who are leaving comments. You know, that’s how I would use Instagram as a writer.

Um, but another, another thing that you brought up that I think is worth, you know, is worth repeating and worth kind of diving into a little bit is kind of the difference between the videos that you’re producing and how they kind of work really well on Instagram and, and wanting to get stuff on YouTube. To me, the fundamental difference there is, is how long the content lasts and how long it’s useful and effective.

Kyle (24:35):

Yeah. If you went in or if somebody went in, you got a notification on your phone right now that somebody had liked one of your Instagram posts from 2015, you would be like, what are they doing? Looking at my posts from 2015, you know, like they are digging, you really wanted to, to find some dirt on me or something, you know.

But if somebody goes in and watches a YouTube video, you know, that maybe has some timeless advice or some, you know, sort of evergreen, you know, content, you know, and, and those posts continue to grow and grow and grow. YouTube is a really powerful brand building tool, you know, over the long-term. And that’s why, you know, people always say YouTube is either the second or depending on how you look at it, the biggest search engine on, on the internet right now, right.

Kyle (25:21):

You know, where, where people are going in and it’s, how do I blank? How do I change the oil in my 2014? F-150, you know, and like are six videos and the cream rises to the top. And probably the top video is from 2015, you know, in that truck had just come out and people are watching it.

And, and I think for, you know, for, for folks like us who are in kind of this client services thing, and we find ourselves answering the same questions over and over again from our clients, you know, it’s, Hey, here’s this video, that’s going to be really valuable content for a lot of people, because I know that, you know, nine out of my last 10 clients have asked me this specific question. So I’m going to make some content about it. You know, I’m going to write a really good description on YouTube and I’m going to let that content do some of the legwork for me over the next two or three or four, or however many years, you know, and people watch that video.

And then there’s a link to your, you know, to your website or, you know, there’s links to other videos that you’ve done that might have similar topics. You know, you can really, you can create a library on YouTube. That’ll do you a lot of favors for a really long time.

Roy (26:24):

Yeah. And that’s a good point. It gets back to asking the right questions and then listening, you know, when we have prospects or customers, because then we can gear, you know, if, if they’ve got that question, probably somebody else out there has it too, but yeah, wouldn’t, wasn’t what I was going to say is that.

So I made little short clips and, uh, just threw one out cause we just been kind of messing around with it and I don’t really know how to operate or the best messaging, but we just pulled out some audio put together, uh, you know, a couple picks, a couple still pictures that we had taken and put it out there. And, um, instantly we had more, uh, activity on that post then, you know, we’d had on a couple where it was just the stills and a message with the, and you know, again, it gets back to the writing skills, maybe the copy in those other ones, wasn’t that hot.

Roy (27:17):

But I was just very surprised that, you know, this little one minute video clip that is basically, it’s a video format, but it’s more just moving pictures that, um, it just, it kind of blew up on Instagram. So, you know, it was a pleasant surprise. And so, you know, we’re going to be working a lot more with that because here again, it transcends you, you know, something you can use on YouTube as well. It’s not that long.

But, uh, you know, if we can get some pick up a few hits off of it, that’s what we’re looking for. So then that kind of leads to the next thing is, um, so there’s a difference between vanity likes and actually attracting customers. And it, luckily it was a very cheap lesson I learned a long time ago, you know, a guy said, Hey, um, uh, you know, I can sure help you out generate some traffic, some likes, some interest, blah, blah, whatever, you know, and luckily, like I said, it didn’t cost me a lot of money. I said, yeah, go ahead. And we’ll give it a try. Well, they were all from, uh, basically as all from Africa and all from Asia. And I guess they have like, like farms over there where they got people just sitting around, like in post.

And so the conversation that we ended up having with him after that is, you know, that’s awesome to have a thousand likes on this deal, but unfortunately there was not one of those people that was a buyer. So there’s a huge difference in vanity traffic and, you know, attracting buyers.

Kyle (28:48):

That’s exactly right. And so when I, when I work with clients, I have this, this three phase framework and it’s, uh, if you imagine a three by three grid, um, you know, the bottom phase is what I call traction and that’s where, and it’s on my shirt. So our three, our three phases, our traction action and tribe. So the bottom phases is that traction phase. And it’s, what am I saying? Who am I saying it to?

And what do I actually have for say, you know, if you know, what can I put, what can I put a barcode on that says, you know, I have this to sell you. It costs this much, and here’s what you get for it. You know? And so we, we get really clear on who it is that we’re talking to, what it is that we have for sale, and then how we’re different from everybody else in that market.

Kyle (29:29):

Yes. Because if you don’t have any competition, I say this all the time. If you don’t have any competition, if you’re the first one into a market, you’re either about to be broke or you’re about to be a billion. Because if, if nobody’s in that market, chances are really, really good. It’s a bad idea. Exactly. Yeah. Um, then when you get to that second level, the action phase, the action phase is, okay, now that we’ve got this message, how are we going to actually put it into action? How are we going to put it into the world in a way that’s effective, not just for driving likes and traffic and website visits and comments, or because I can’t, I can’t take comments to the bank. When I take a bag full of comments up to SunTrust, they say, I’m not trouble.

Kyle (30:09):

So, so if I go, if I go first into, all right, well, I’m going to start driving a bunch of traffic. And that’s what a lot of people do. They start a business and they go, well, I’m gonna start an Instagram account and Facebook and a YouTube channel. And you go, okay, well, that’s great, but you’re a dog chasing cars right now, because what in the world are you going to do with that traffic? Once you catch it? Where are you pointing? You know, because if you’ve got a lot of eyeballs, but you don’t have anywhere to send them and you don’t have any way to convert those eyeballs into customers, then those eyeballs are pointless. They don’t do anything. Yeah. So I start with where, what our platforms look like, you know, what does our website look like? Do we have any landing pages?

Kyle (30:48):

What’s the, what’s the, the organization and the structure of our sales sequence and our, our customer journey. So that they go, okay, this is the first thing I’m gonna offer you. Here’s the next thing. Here’s the next thing, you know, what our social platforms actually look like. And then the next phase is how do we sell them? This stuff, you know, are we doing this on the phone? Are they buying it online? Are we, you know, meeting over zoom? Or we, you know, we write letters to each other, you know, how are we, how are we buying this stuff?

And then once I’ve got that, once I’ve got my website, I’ve got my offer, I’ve got everything all set up. And I can, I confident in my ability to convert sales now. Yeah. Turn on that faucet. But before that, you know, if you, if you try to fill up that bucket, that bucket’s got all kinds of holes in it, you know, and you’re never going to fill that bucket up. You’re going to be constantly working, you know? So build the systems, build the structures, put those in place before you ever start driving people to.

Roy (31:39):

Which gets back to a good point is, you know, you need a roadmap of where you are today, where you really need to go. And there’s a lot of infrastructure that’s wrapped around that, you know, it gets back to your website, your Facebook business page, your LinkedIn business page, you know, you really have to have all that. Um, pretty solid, you know, cause you don’t want somebody, you finally attract that gun. He goes over to one of your pages and it looks like junk or there’s nothing there. And so that, you know, for myself, I’ll say that turns me off if, if to not, uh, if it’s not done. Right. So that’s right.

Kyle (32:16):

Yeah. You got to see that there’s something there, right. Or decide that that’s not the platform for you. It’s totally okay to say, Hey, look, I’m not on Instagram. I don’t have a business page on Instagram. Everything that I do happens on Facebook or happens on LinkedIn or happens via email or happens, you know, however it happens. But to your point, you know, if they show up on your LinkedIn page, you know, and your business LinkedIn page is, you know, the standard logo that’s there before you even upload your own logo.

It’s got the title of your page and there’s never been a post or, you know, it’s like testing one, two, three, you know, and they go, this guy doesn’t have a clue what he’s doing, and this is a ghost town, you know? So if you’re not going to take the time to set that platform up correctly and actually tend to your field, you know, and you know, and plant and harvest and that kind of stuff, then you know, why buy the land?

Roy (33:07):

Yeah. Well, and that’s another good point that, uh, I meant to make earlier that you were talking about, you know, when we’re talking about the kids, watching the videos and bugging mom and dad and they’re hap you know, there’s some timeframe in between there before they purchase, is that, you know, with the digital age, we seem to get ahead of ourself and we want to go straight from planting the seed harvesting, and sometimes all in the same minute, you know, and like you said, you know, the, well there’s the cultivation in between.

That can be what eight to 12 touches is what we need to count on, uh, you know, before we close a sale. And if you, if you do anything less than that, you’re just lucky, but it’s not something that, you know, unless you’re a high pressure in the home salesman where, you know, you just don’t leave until you get a check. Um, th typically that doesn’t happen. You’re going to have to drip, drip, drip, and, uh, hold their attention over time.

Kyle (34:02):

There was a concept that was explained to me, not a long time ago that I feel like applies to everything. I teach it with the kids that I teach and with, uh, marketing clients. And then I apply it with my own, which is this idea of an emotional bank account. And that, that, anytime I’m asking for something, anytime I’m, you know, pushing for a sale or, um, you know, with the kids that I work with, anytime I’m correcting them or disciplining them, or, you know, even with my own kids, when I’m, you know, when I’m correcting them or reprimanding them for something, then that is a withdrawal from that bank account, you know, and that’s okay.

As long as I’ve built up the capital to make that withdrawal. All right. And you know, and so if it’s, you know, if I’m running a marketing campaign and I’m, I’m working with clients, you know, I want to contribute, I want to add value.

Kyle (34:53):

I want to make deposits in that bank account so that when I look at them and I say, Hey, look, I’ve got this new offer. This thing that I’m, you know, I’m selling now. Then they go, I know Kyle, I like him. I trust him, you know, and I’m going to, you know, I’m going to believe that he has my best interests at heart because he’s shown me over and over and over again that he has my best interests at heart, you know?

And yes, it’s a withdrawal for him to ask for this from me. But, uh, but I trust him and he can do that because he’s given so freely in the past, you know? And so when we’re, you know, when a lot of people think about running, particularly going back to like digital advertising, when they think like, all right, I’m going to throw some money on Facebook or onto YouTube, or, you know, whatever the platform they think that it has to be this transactional.

Kyle (35:41):

I have this for sale. Do you want to buy it? And I’m going to Ram that message down your throat by throwing my ad budget at you. Here’s what I have for sale. Do you want it? Do you want it? Right where it doesn’t have to be that, you know, it can be, Hey, look, I’m going to throw a little bit of money at this helpful, you know, I made a helpful video on how to X, Y, or Z, I’m going to put it on Facebook or Instagram or YouTube, and I’m gonna throw some money at it.

You know, I’m going to show it to a lot of the people who are in my ecosystem, I’m going to let them see it. I’m going to let them build their trust with me, you know? And then I’m going to, you know, we’re getting a little bit complex here, but now I’m going to build retargeting audiences of people who have watched that video. And I’m going to say, Hey, look, here’s another video. Here’s another helpful tip. And then after that, you know, I’ve got people who have watched two videos and they’ve got, you know, just the best feeling in the world about me. And then I go, Hey, I’ve got this thing for sale. I help people just like you, if you’re interested in that. And they go, well sure. You know, absolutely. I’m interested in that. Right?

Roy (36:36):

Yeah. That’s a good point in that, like you said, we could do another episode on, you know, this kind of the same thing with content and, and pushing out emails. I feel that, you know, you just don’t want to push an email out that says, Hey, this is Roy. I’ve got this service, uh, when can I sign you up? Or how fast can you get me some money? I mean, we have to build that value. And, you know, we talk about the same thing, provide them something that’s useful. You know, you have to keep them, keep their attention by providing that usefulness until they are ready to buy our teak and ask for the buyer.

So, well, you know, kind of, uh, I’m gonna, we’re gonna have to wrap it up for today. I’d love to have you back on, uh, you’ve been awesome guests. And like I said, I got more, I got a ton of questions. I could sit here for hours and hours. And, uh, so we’ll get you back on love to kind of go a little bit deeper into this, uh, the digital advertising and marketing part. But before we let you go, um, what is one tool that you use either a tool, habit, ritual that you use either in your personal life or in business that you just don’t think you could do without every day?

Kyle (37:45):

All right. It’s a weird one. I’m going to guess that you’ve never gotten this book. And I was thinking about what are the things, what are the cause? You know, when, when you prepped me for this question, I was like, all right, what do I use every day? The one thing that I use more often than anything else is graph paper.

I don’t remember. I don’t remember the last time that I wrote on lined paper. I’m real analog pen to paper on almost everything. I exclusively buy graph paper because I’m making, you know, charts and boxes and stuff like that. So I use, I use graph paper and the one thing I’ll do, I’ve got just a composition notebook, you know, the notebooks look like a cow on the front. Um, but it’s got, it’s got graph paper in it. Yeah.

Roy (38:27):

Interesting. Yeah. So is your, you’re not an engineer background, are you? No, not at all. Okay. Now the reason I ask, I used to work with guy frequently and that’s all he used was GRA he was an engineer by trade. Every note that I got from him, this was back in the old days of the fax Bayer time. I’d get a fax. I couldn’t read the words on it because all correct.

Kyle (38:47):

It’s on graph paper. Yeah. So I love graph paper, you know, to actually make it a useful tool for me. What I do is, um, every night before I go to bed, um, you know, I’m not, I’m not a big like morning routine or evening routine kind of guy. You know, I don’t have a, I’m not, uh, up before the sun drinking my mushroom coffee and meditating for quite like I don’t, I don’t. Um, but I do write down, um, the three things that I want to accomplish the next day. So I go, I go into every day, seven days a week, I go, and it could be PR it could be professional.

It could be personal. It could be, I’m going to take my daughter on a date. Could be, you know, whatever it is, um, three things that I’m going to get done the next day. And those are my non-negotiables for that day. So if things come up and it’s, you know, I gotta, I gotta sacrifice one of those three things to make this other thing happen. I know that that’s a no for me. So it’s, it’s three things that are my non-negotiables for the next day. And I figure if I can get three really solid things done every day. Um, you know,

Roy (39:44):

Yeah. Yeah. That’s an awesome answer. Yeah. I haven’t heard that one and probably won’t for awhile. So on the graph paper. So if you don’t mind, uh, tell everybody not only how they could get a hold of you, uh, you know, for the digital marketing, but tell a little bit about the martial arts studio as well.

Kyle (40:01):

Yeah. So the, uh, the martial arts school, uh, it’s called the dojo real simple dojo is just a, uh, a gym, a place where you train. Okay. So the brand is the dojo. We’re in Atlanta a little bit North of Atlanta. Um, we’ve got about six locations, so we’re kind of all over the place up there. But, uh, yeah, that’s, that’s the martial arts school, but for, you know, for folks who are listening to this, um, my primary website is guideposts

What I do there is really just help business owners of all shapes and sizes get really clear on their message on who it is that they’re trying to talk to. Um, and then once that message is, is really dialed in and clear in a way that their customers respond to it and you know, that their ears perk up.

Kyle (40:45):

We talk about how to get it out into the world, you know, whether that’s on your website or an email campaigns or social media or paid ads or whatever it is. You know, it starts with that foundation of, you know, a story-based message, um, you know, positioning the customer is the hero and your company, as the guide who can help them solve their problems. Um, that’s kind of the crux of the messaging and we create that messaging so that it really resonates with your customers.

And then we put it out in the world and, and businesses see just, you know, really solid results. Um, and it’s something that you can, you know, it never goes out of style, no matter what platform you’re using, you can always, you know, you can always tailor it to however you want to do things. And that’s, that’s what I help folks do. Yeah.

Roy (41:26):

Well, Kyle, we appreciate you being here with us, giving us your time today. It’s been very helpful, a lot of great tips, a lot of things to think about. And so, um, we’re going to go ahead and wrap it up again. This is Roy with the business of business podcast. We look forward to talking to you next time.